#33 Lluc Torcal: physicist turned Catholic monk, the relevance of soulful progress
General Procurator of the Order of Cistercians, PhD in Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics from Pontifical Gregorian University, Physics degree from Autonomous University of Barcelona
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Lluc Torcal is a physicist specialised in quantum mechanics and theologian Catholic monk in the legendary Order of Cistercians, as well as the General Procurator of the order in charge of leading its relationship with the Holy See (the central governing body of the Catholic Church).
The Order of Cistercians is a monastic religious order within the Catholic Church founded in 1098 in France with the vision of reforming monastic life. It was born with a strong emphasis on returning to the principles of humility, simplicity, austerity, manual labor, supporting their communities, and living a more disciplined spiritual life. The Cistercians rapidly expanded throughout Europe, establishing numerous monasteries, becoming a significant religious and economic force during the Middle Ages, and ultimately having a deep historical impact in key areas like agricultural innovation, water management, Gothic architecture, and large-scale industrial enterprises like milling or textile production.
Lluc holds a Summa Cum Laude PhD in Interpretation of Quantum Physics from Pontifical Gregorian University, a degree in Theology from Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas, a degree in Philosophy from Pontifical Gregorian University, and a degree in Physics from the Autonomous University of Barcelona.
Summary
1️⃣ From physicist to Catholic monk
2️⃣ Importance of human dignity in an extremely technological world
3️⃣ Science and Faith
4️⃣ Criticism and conflicts
5️⃣ Opportunities and challenges in the intersection of religion and tech
6️⃣ The marvel of quantum mechanics
7️⃣ Belief systems for positive impact
8️⃣ Advice to not get lost in a noisy world
1️⃣ Physicist focused on quantum mechanics and Catholic monk for the last 30 years … how did your story reach such rare intersection?
It kind of happened at the same time in a very smooth and synergetic way. I started having Catholic Faith when I was around 10-12 years old and at 17 I already wanted to be a monk. However while I was receiving this calling for monastic life, I also started having a deep interest to know more about the world.
I think I wanted to understand in the best possible way everything about the reality that we are in as well as about human nature. So I ended up pursuing physics, philosophy, and theology. Eventually I got my physics degree and ended up joining the Cistercians as a monk in the Monastery of Santa Maria de Poblet.
I always felt this deep rooted fire to learn more about what are we doing in this life and why. And even though I comprehend in today’s world this might sound weird, I never struggled to see the relationship between my Catholic Faith in God and science - because I see God in everything.
2️⃣ Why is religion important in a world where postmodernity and technology advancement seems to dominate?
Exclusive focus on technology can lead to a degradation of the human spirit. The greatness of humanity is not just doing things but being able to understand the why behind it.
I believe our culture, specially during the last years, does it backwards. There are always exceptions but it seems like in the current era it is more about 100% focus on technology advancement at the expense of a profound understanding of the consequences of what we are actually doing.
Given this context, religion can play an essential role in terms of helping establish a proper direction that allows us to use technology to improve dignity of human condition - reversing what still seems to be the current dominant order of the world, based on using human dignity to boost technology evolution just because technology evolution itself.
Again, not saying there aren’t exceptions to this as well as good intentions, but when we look at the tech world there seems to be a lot of blurred lines covered with nice story tellings but lacking contemplation (understood as a deep reflective thought of truly building for the good of humanity).
3️⃣ The compatibility of science and Faith has been questioned many times. Are religion and science friends or enemies?
What is incompatible are Faith and ideologies.
Regardless of someone being a believer or not, the truth is not only what can be discovered through mathematic language or scientific method. Those are very important ways of seeing certain aspects of the world, but it is important not to confuse science with science-based ideology. For instance, there are other ways of thinking and reasoning such as art, poetry, music, or even philosophy, that can not necessarily be fully understood through the scientific method.
It is going to be tough trying to understand love through a mathematical formula, as it is appreciating the functioning of a human cell using physics and not biology. The scope of human reason goes way beyond one unique way to look at things and there are still more questions than answers.
And if you have faith, I’d say there is even less incompatibility. From a theological point of view, God, in the Genesis, created the world with a notion of it being good and intelligible. There is truth and there are methods to know truth, such as our intelligence. You can’t follow your Faith using your intelligence and end up finding incompatibilities - it is more about limits of knowledge rather than that.
4️⃣ What are your thoughts regarding the criticism of historical conflicts between science and religious institutions such as the Church?
Well, first of all, institutions such as the Catholic Church are made of people and absolutely no one is free from flaws. We, as humans, are capable of good things and also of bad ones. The Church is no exception.
In terms of conflicts related to science we find examples like the very well-known situation with Galileo. And for sure there are more. But when this type of controversies are pointed out, it could be interesting to know more about the context. For instance in this Galileo situation at that time, some people within the Church showed support for the astronomer’s scientific findings.
Despite the prevailing negative narrative, I don’t believe the Church has been systematically against improvements. From education to health or other social services, the institution has fostered very relevant positive developments for the world. Denying this is simply a matter of ideology going against historical facts.
5️⃣ What future opportunities and challenges do you see in the intersection of religion and technology?
In my opinion, the key for the future is the harmony between humanity and technology. How to integrate technology evolution in our daily lives while respecting and enhancing personal dignity.
Tech is a fruit of human intelligence and it strongly depends on how we develop it. If everything we build serves to positively improve the person in a good way - welcome it. But if not, it needs to be denounced, combated, and stopped.
Also, technology must integrate itself with the human dignity, and we need to land these sometimes abstract ideas into very concrete facts.
One example of this type of opportunity and challenge binomial is transhumanism (in the hardcore sense, not just using technology to enhance human capabilities but extremely pushing the boundaries undermining essential aspects of what it means to be human). Why? Because it reduces the person to an individual entity, limits intelligence to calculus excellence, and removes the issue of pain inhumanly. So basically turns the person into an inmortal individualized calculating machine without relations. It doesn’t integrate tech and humanity, and it doesn’t integrate the person with the human condition of the others because some will be able to do it and others won’t (which could result in the creation of yet another vulnerable class of people - maybe even worse than what we have already seen before).
And alternative to this is positively enhancing human conditions in areas like regenerative medicine. Not aspiring to alter the core of what a human is (even to the genetics if needed), but helping nature express its full capabilities.
Another examples of exciting frontiers in the intersection of religion and science could be artificial intelligence and climate tech.
In AI we are hearing a lot of noise lately about creation of intelligence, however beyond the hype it looks more like we are focused on providing great enablers of information. The human brain is quite a lot more than that. It is going to be very interesting to experience what approaches to surpass current limitations are being implemented and shared with the world.
And in climate tech seems like we are finally realising the huge challenges humanity has to face to ensure a favourable future. Very compelling opportunities in key areas like energy are getting momentum. Innovation in this realm is very interesting because how it integrates the individuality of the person, human communities, and the global ecosystem as a whole. It kind of forces you to avoid human reductionism that some political fractions try to impose. Pope Francis wrote about this themes in “Laudato Si”, an encyclical letter focused on the topics of the environment, climate, human ecology, social justice, technology, and progress.
6️⃣ Can you share a moment where a science related discovery has impacted your Faith?
In my journey both faith and science have moved quite in parallel so it is not like I focused in this type of moments. Nevertheless it is true that the more you learn, the more you marvel about the miracle of life and the world.
I remember studying quantum mechanics and just being in awe of the complexity that underlies the beautiful reality we live in. Learning about concepts like entanglement (where two particles are intertwined even if they are apart and changing the state of one particle instantly affects the other regardless of distance) influencing the way we think about the unique interconnectedness of the world, or uncertainty (principle stating fundamental limits on how to precisely and simultaneously know certain properties of a particle) provoking the thought of mysterious indeterminacy where interaction in general (e.g. observation) can play a major role actually affecting the behaviour or state of a particle - it’s amazing. And then on top of this incredible complexity that forms the basis of our physical world, having things like love … it just makes me admire even more the creation of God.
7️⃣ We are in a world where the belief system of a few number of individual builders can end up having major impact. Based on your experience, what should be taken into account so the impact ends up being more positive than negative?
Talking from the point of view of a belief system based on Christianity where God becomes man in Jesus Christ, saves us, and reaches full communion with humanity; maybe the first step is to have a more complete vision that transcends individuality and has a very strong commitment to improve the life of humanity. Not just winning for oneself alone.
If you have Faith and your believe system is not fundamentally focused on winning to improve the dignity of humanity, your Faith has not truly conquered your heart. You must have hope against the problems caused by evil and you must work for justice in this world.
If you don’t have Faith, sometimes it can be tougher to obtain and sustain this hopeful vision of serving humanity in the long term, since the difficulties and pain inherent to life can push you towards exclusive focus on your own path and living a bit more closed to the rest.
8️⃣ What advice would you give to make a meaningful positive influence in life and avoid getting lost in a noisy society that sometimes feels increasingly less human?
Our life is a way full of challenges where we will need to take decisions that will have consequences. We have been given life and capacities to make an impact in the world. Let’s be conscious about the mission for which we are here, be responsible of our development, and take risks to serve others.
Specially, I want to emphasise the call to truly and honestly serve others as much as you can. Make the best you can to improve the life of those around you. If you don’t fight for it, things will not change. Add your “little grain of sand”.
Finally, be mindful about the fact that absolutely everyone makes mistakes. Do not let fear dominate and freeze you. There will be uncertainty, steps forward but also steps back, moments of rising and moments of falling. Trust God’s hands and let him guide you.
Big thanks Lluc for sharing your views with us!
Big thanks to you, reader, for your time and interest!
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